By Jeje Gomez, Marilyn Dubinski, Mark Barrington, Jacob Douglas, Bill Huan, J.R. Wilco | Pounding The Rock (PtR), 2024-08-09 23:41:19
由生成式人工智能翻译，译文内容可能不准确或不完整，以原文为准。
PtR 工作人员对 NBA 冠军与世界冠军的争议发表了看法，试图组建一支可以击败美国队的球队，并试图弄清楚为什么美国在三人篮球赛中表现不佳。
美国男女三人篮球队均未获得金牌。你对此感到惊讶，还是说在意料之中，毕竟美国不像其他国家那样重视这项运动？
玛丽莲·杜宾斯基(Marilyn Dubinski): 这件事引起了我的注意，所以我写了一篇文章，然后组建了我自己完全不切实际的马刺队三人篮球队。话虽如此，你也必须考虑为什么这些球队，尤其是男队，如此平庸：球员必须参加资格赛才能参加奥运会，而资格赛是在 NBA 赛季期间进行的，因此吉默·弗雷戴特(Jimmer Fredette) 是那里最熟悉的面孔。如果球队由现役 NBA 球员组成，也许是那些刚好在正赛中被淘汰的球员，那将会更加精彩，但要做到这一点，规则和/或时间安排就必须改变。
马克·巴灵顿(Mark Barrington): 说实话，我直到在今年的电视报道中看到三人篮球才意识到它是一项奥运会比赛项目。我以前打野球的时候，真的很喜欢半场，因为我的体力和速度都不足以支撑全场，而这是一种像吉默·弗雷戴特这样的球员可以脱颖而出的比赛，因为它不太讲究运动能力，而更讲究技术和技巧。美国队在弗雷戴特受伤后就注定要失败了，他们不得不在整场比赛中都没有替补的情况下比赛。即使弗雷戴特在场上，他们也不足以获得奖牌，所以他们需要付出更多才能有竞争力。三人篮球赛的比赛方式与众不同，现役 NBA 球员不能只是加入进来就能立即掌握，如果能加入一些可以打野球风格的退役球员就更好了。我想知道贾马尔·克劳福德(Jamal Crawford) 是否有兴趣？
杰森·戈麦斯(Jesus Gomez): 这有点令人惊讶，因为仅凭天赋，美国就应该占据绝对优势。女队在 2020 年获得金牌，在 2024 年获得铜牌，所以她们的表现还不错，但男队没有获得奖牌，而且在 2020 年也没有进入奥运会。资格问题阻碍了最佳人选的参赛，但除了吉默·弗雷戴特之外，还有很多最近退役的 NBA 球员本可以加入，但却没有。最终，将有更多高水平球员投身于这种比赛模式，但如果美国队需要一段时间才能成为领头羊，我也不会感到惊讶。
J.R. 威尔科(J.R. Wilco): 三人篮球赛的胜负并不仅仅取决于天赋。它依赖于团队合作、沟通和了解队友的位置。因此，最好的球队将是那些始终在一起打球、赢得地区和国家锦标赛并经常出国比赛的球队。如果美国的三人篮球体系现在还不足以培养出足够优秀的球队来做到这一切，那么我非常怀疑情况是否会有所改变，除非这项运动变得更加普及。它现在有多受欢迎？嗯，在我周日下午一起观看奥运会的那群人中，我是唯一一个知道三人篮球赛的人。所以，从这个角度来看，它还有很大的发展空间。
短跑金牌得主诺亚·莱尔斯(Noah Lyles) 继续因其过去发表的 NBA 冠军不是世界冠军 的言论而面临批评。你同意莱尔斯的观点吗？
杜宾斯基: 我对这件事引起如此大的轰动感到有点惊讶，因为说实话，我认为称 NBA 冠军为“世界”冠军的说法在很久以前就已经消失了，也许是在马刺队经常凭借国际球员赢得胜利的时候。(我想这说明了马刺队赛季结束后我很少关注 NBA。)我理解争论双方的观点：NBA 冠军很可能在状态不佳的情况下 10 次中有 9 次都能击败世界上任何其他球队，但事实是我们不知道，因为没有这样的比赛。此外，这项运动正在发展，爆冷也确实会发生。反对称 NBA 冠军为“世界冠军”的另一个理由是，曼城目前排名 世界职业足球队第一，但他们不被认为是足球“世界冠军”；这个头衔属于赢得 2022 年国际足联世界杯的阿根廷队，那是规模最大的国际比赛。
巴灵顿: 这是一句客观上正确的话，所以没有理由为此感到生气。NBA 是地球上最好的篮球联赛，但他们不与其他国家（加拿大除外）的球队比赛。我很想看到更多美国球队与欧洲球队的表演赛，并最终形成真正的比赛。国际篮球水平正在提高，他们最终有可能与 NBA 竞争。除了美国之外，很多国家的职业篮球最大的问题是，最好的球员都在 NBA 打球，但在奥运会这样的比赛中，水平会更加均衡，我认为欧洲球队最终有可能击败美国队。我只是希望今年不要发生这种情况。
戈麦斯: 这是一场关于语义的讨论，已经持续了很长时间。事实上，横幅上没有必要写上“世界冠军”。即使这不是故意的，也会让人觉得傲慢和不尊重其他国家。归根结底，NBA 是一个国内联赛，即使它比其他任何联赛都要好得多。如果你赢得了总冠军，你就是 NBA 冠军，这已经足够令人印象深刻和有声望了。这并不是什么大事，但我能理解为什么有些人对此有异议，尤其是像莱尔斯这样大部分时间都在国际赛场上比赛的人。
威尔科: 整个“世界冠军”的说法始于 1904 年左右，当时美国职业棒球大联盟将其冠军称为世界大赛，以使其听起来更宏大。(显然，这种说法在 20 世纪初很有效。而且，考虑到当时唯一打美式棒球的人住在美国，这种说法在那时是准确的，尽管并不十分相关。这就像说地球以拥有“银河系最佳棒球运动员”而闻名。在我们殖民火星并且他们组建一支球队之前，这句话都是对的。当你所在联盟的冠军实际上并没有与来自本国以外的任何球队比赛时，称他们为世界冠军就有点太过自负了。这不是我想要争取的东西，但现在世界其他地方也喜欢上了这项运动，足以使其成为一个开放性问题，出于礼貌，即使没有其他原因，我们也应该停止这种说法。
你能组建一支由五名没有进入奥运会的球员组成的球队，来挑战美国队吗？（你可以使用美国职业球员、国际职业球员或大学生球员。）
杜宾斯基: 这很难，因为我脑海中浮现的每个人要么已经在奥运会上了，要么年纪太大了。显然，你必须从杰伦·布朗(Jaylen Brown) 开始，他对被排除在外感到愤怒，他会带着一种不服输的精神去比赛。除此之外，我觉得你必须追求得分，所以我将组建一个由特雷·杨(Trae Young) 和卢卡·东契奇(Luka Doncic) 组成的后场（由于选秀之夜的交易，他们一直被捆绑在一起，所以为什么不让他们在一起呢），也许可以冒险加入库珀·弗拉格(Cooper Flagg)，因为他已经在陪练队中证明了自己，最后用卡尔-安东尼·唐斯(Karl-Anthony Towns) 完善阵容，他可以得分、抢篮板，并帮助分散美国队的内线球员。（然后我会把卢卡和唐斯拉到一边，提醒他们国际篮联的比赛比 NBA 更强调身体对抗，所以要强硬起来，不要对裁判咆哮。）
巴灵顿: 这是一个有趣的心理游戏，但很明显，今年的美国奥运代表队是有史以来在篮球场上聚集的最优秀的人才之一。你可以组建一支由没有完全入选国家队的 NBA 球员组成的球队，使其具有一定的竞争力，但他们不会赢得很多比赛。我会选择杰伦·布朗，他没有被选中是因为不适合，以及玛丽莲提到的那些人。卢卡之所以有空，是因为斯洛文尼亚队在资格赛中被淘汰了，但他可能是这支球队中最好的球员。杰伦·布伦森(Jaylen Brunson) 可以连续得分。在所有这些努力之后，你最终会得到一支仍然无法与美国 A 队抗衡的球队。你只需要称赞格兰特·希尔(Grant Hill) 和史蒂夫·科尔(Steve Kerr) 组建了一支篮球巨无霸。
戈麦斯: 这可能有点作弊，因为他之前是美国队的一员，后来退出了，但我还是会选择科怀·伦纳德(Kawhi Leonard)。这是一场短期比赛，所以他也许能够保持健康。卢卡·东契奇和杰伦·布朗是板上钉钉的选择。这三个人都需要球权，所以我需要一些 3D 角色球员。杰伦·杰克逊(Jaren Jackson Jr.) 将是我的中锋人选，因为他身高臂长，技术全面，而亚历克斯·卡鲁索(Alex Caruso) 将是我的后卫人选，因为马库斯·斯马特(Marcus Smart) 受伤了，我需要一个出色的对位防守球员。这支五人阵容拥有防守、投篮、运动能力，尤其是投篮能力，至少可以给美国队制造麻烦。
威尔科: 首先，有一点：
我刚刚重温了第四节，美国队没有布置任何战术，也没有打任何配合，伙计，那纯粹是绝望的篮球。
赶紧得分的那种篮球。
— 尼科 (@nikotaughtyou) 2024 年 8 月 9 日
我认为这在很大程度上解释了为什么世界其他国家正在赶超美国。最终，美国仅仅拥有最好的球员是不够的。然后，他们将不得不真正学会如何团结协作，以发挥出 1+1>2 的力量。你知道，就像一支球队那样。
所以，如果世界上没有任何一支国家队能够击败美国队，那么就只能是一支今年夏天没有球员前往巴黎的 NBA 球队了。我想那就是达拉斯独行侠队(Dallas Mavericks) 了？他们可能无法在 7 场系列赛中战胜勒布朗(LeBron) 和他的队友，但他们肯定能赢一场！
点击查看原文：NBA champions are not world champions
NBA champions are not world champions
The PtR staff offers their thoughts on the controversy about NBA champion vs. world champion, attempts to build a team that can beat Team USA, and tries to figure out why the US struggles in 3x3 basketball.
The US didn’t win gold in either men’s or women’s 3x3 basketball. Did it surprise you or was it expected, since the country doesn’t take the sport as seriously as others yet?
Marilyn Dubinski: It caught my attention enough that wrote about it a bit then made up my own completely unrealistic Spurs 3x3 teams. That being said, you also have to consider why the teams, especially the men, are unexciting: the players have to participate in the qualifiers to play in the Olympics, and that’s during the NBA season, hence why Jimmer Fredette was the most recognizable face there. It would be much more exciting to have the team consist of current NBA players, perhaps ones that just missed the cut for the main squad, but for that to happen, the rules and/or timing will have to change.
Mark Barrington: Honestly, I didn’t know that 3x3 basketball was an Olympic sport until I saw it on this year’s TV coverage. When I played back in pickup games, I really preferred halfcourt games, because I wasn’t in good enough shape or quick enough to keep up in a full court game, and it’s the kind of game where a guy like Jimmer Fredette can excel because it’s not so much about athleticism as it is about skill and craftiness. The US squad was doomed when Fredette got injured and they had to play without subs for the entire game. Even with Jimmer in the lineup, they weren’t good enough to medal, so they will need to do more to be competitive. The 3x3 game is different enough that current NBA players can’t just jump in and immediately master, and it would be nice to add some retired players who can play pickup-style ball. I wonder if Jamal Crawford is interested?
Jesus Gomez: It’s a little surprising because on talent alone the US should absolutely dominate. The women’s team won gold in 2020 and bronze in 2024, so they are doing fine, but the men’s team has no medals and didn’t make it to the Games in 2020. The eligibility issues prevent the best candidates from suiting up, but there are enough recently retired NBA players who could jump in but haven’t, aside from Jimmer Fredette. Eventually more high-level players will commit to the game mode but I wouldn’t be shocked if it takes the US a while to become the top dog.
J.R. Wilco: The 3x3 game is not based on talent alone. It’s reliant on teamwork, communication and knowing where your teammates are going to be. So the best teams are going to be the ones that play together all the time, and win regional and national tournaments, and travel well. If the US’s 3x3 system isn’t producing teams good enough to do all of that now, then I doubt much will change unless the sport gets more popular. How popular is it now? Well, of the group of people I was watching the Olympics with on Sunday afternoon, I was the only one who even knew that 3x3 was a thing. So, by that measure there’s quite of room to grow.
Gold medalist sprinter Noah Lyles continues to face criticism for comments he made in the past saying the NBA champion is not the world champion. Do you agree with Lyles?
Dubinski: I’m kind of surprised such a fuss has been made about it because, to be honest, I thought calling the NBA champions “world” champions faded away a while ago, perhaps around the time the Spurs were winning so often with international players. (I guess it goes to show how little I pay attention once the Spurs’ season ends.) I get both sides of the argument: the NBA champion would likely beat any other team in the world 9 times out of 10 on a bad day, but the fact is we don’t know that for sure because there is no such competition. Plus, the sport is growing, and upsets do happen. Another case against calling the NBA champion the “world champions” would be Manchester City is currently ranked as the top professional soccer team in the world, but they aren’t considered the “world champs” of soccer; that title belongs to Argentina, who won the 2022 FIFA World Cup: the biggest international competition.
Barrington: It’s a statement that’s objectively true, so there’s no reason to get upset about it. The NBA is the best basketball league on the planet, but they don’t play against teams from other countries (except Canada). I would love to see more exhibition games with US teams against European teams, and eventually a real competition. International basketball is improving, and it could happen that they’re eventually going to become competitive with the NBA. The biggest problem for a lot of pro basketball in countries besides the US is that the best players are all playing in the NBA, but in competitions like the Olympics, it’s a little more balanced, and I could see a European team eventually knocking off the Stars and Stripes. I just hope it’s not this year.
Gomez: It’s a semantics discussion that has been going on for a long time. In reality, there’s no need for the banners to read “world champions.” It comes off as arrogant and disrespectful to other countries even if that’s not the intention. In the end, the NBA is a domestic league even if it’s leaps and bounds better than any other. If you win the title, you are an NBA champion and that’s impressive and prestigious enough. It’s not a huge deal, but I can understand why some people have an issue with it, especially people like Lyles who compete at the international level most of the time.
Wilco: The whole “World Champions” thing began around 1904 with Major League Baseball calling it’s title the World Series to make it sound grand. (Apparently that kind of thing worked in the early 20th century. And it was accurate at that point if not particularly relevant seeing that the ONLY people playing America’s brand of baseball lived in the US at that point. That made it kind of like saying that Earth is known for having “Best Ballplayers in the Galaxy.” It’ll be true until we colonize Mars and they put a team together. Calling your league’s winners the champions of the world when they don’t actually PLAY any teams from outside your country is more than a bit presumptuous. It’s not anything I’d campaign over, but now the rest of the world likes the sport enough to make it an open question, it’d probably be a good idea to stop out of politeness if for no other reason.
Can you build a five-man team of players who didn’t make it to the Olympics that could challenge Team USA? (You can use American pros, international pros or college players.)
Dubinski: This is hard because everyone off the top of my head is either already in the Olympics or old. Obviously you have to start with Jaylen Brown, who is angry about being left out and would play with a chip on his shoulder. Beyond that, I feel you have to go for points, so I would insert a backcourt of Trae Young and Luka Doncic (who have always been been tied at the hip due to draft night trades, so why not see them together), maybe throw caution to the wind and add Cooper Flagg since he held his own on the practice squad, and round out the lineup with Karl-Anthony Towns, who can score, rebound and help spread out Team USA’s centers. (I would then pull Luka and KAT aside and remind them that FIBA is more physical than the NBA, so toughen up and don’t bark at the refs.)
Barrington: This is an interesting mental exercise, but it’s pretty obvious that this year’s US Olympic team is one of the best assemblies of basketball talent ever put together on the court. You could assemble a team of NBA players who didn’t quite make the squad and make it somewhat competitive, but they’re not going to win many games. I would include Jaylen Brown, who wasn’t selected because of fit, and most of the guys that Marilyn mentioned. Luka is only available because Slovenia was eliminated from qualifying, but he might be the best player on the team. Jaylen Brunson can score points in bunches. After all of this effort, you would end up with a team that’s still not going to be able to stay on the court with the US A-Team. You just have to give credit to Grant Hill and Steve Kerr for putting together a basketball juggernaut.
Gomez: This might be cheating because he was a part of Team USA before bowing out but I’d start with Kawhi Leonard. It’s a short tournament, so he might be able to stay healthy through it. Luka Doncic and Jaylen Brown are a lock. All three of those guys need the ball, so I’d need some 3-and-D role players. Jaren Jackson Jr. would be my pick at center because of his length and versatility and Alex Caruso as my guard, since Marcus Smart is hurt and I need a great point-of-attack defender. That five-man squad has the defense, shooting, athleticism and especially the shot-making to at least give Team USA trouble.
Wilco: First, there’s this:
I just rewatched that 4th quarter, USA wasn’t calling no plays or running sets man, that was just pure desperation hoops.
GO GET A BUCKET TYPE HOOPS.
— Niko (@nikotaughtyou) August 9, 2024
Which I think is largely why the rest of the world is catching up. Eventually, the US just having the best players will not be enough. Then they’ll actually have to learn to play together to become greater than the sum of the parts. You know, like a team.
So, if none of the world’s national teams can beat Team USA, then it’d have to be an NBA team that didn’t send anyone to Paris this summer. I guess that makes it the Dallas Mavericks? They might not win a 7 game series against LeBron and Co, but they could take one for sure!
By Jeje Gomez, Marilyn Dubinski, Mark Barrington, Jacob Douglas, Bill Huan, J.R. Wilco, via Pounding The Rock